16:38:03 From Ariel Avissar to Everyone:
Katie's paper: www.thecine-files.com/turning-up-the-volume/
16:50:46 From Mathias Bonde Korsgaard to Everyone:
https://vimeo.com/manage/videos/537234958/f7582c628b
16:59:03 From Maria Pramaggiore to Everyone:
Bravo Mathias!
16:59:32 From Cormac Donnelly to Everyone:
Great. Is there a list of the videos you used?
16:59:48 From Mathias Bonde Korsgaard to Everyone:
There will be, but not yet
17:01:01 From Adrian Martin to Everyone:
Great video, Mathias!
17:02:23 From Amy Skjerseth to Everyone:
Fantastic video, Mathias! Meticulous editing that reminded me of Arthur Jafa’s “Love is the Message, the Message is Death,” a video installation that uses a very rhythmic sort of editing to set its many video clips to Kanye West’s “Ultralight Beam”
17:02:24 From Maria Pramaggiore to Everyone:
Don’t need a break!
17:04:25 From Alissa Lienhard (she/her) to Everyone:
I thought it was really smart to change the music once a new clip "joined" the multiscreen. worked really well for me
17:05:17 From Amy Skjerseth to Everyone:
Agreed, Alissa! It caught my attention both aurally and visually
17:19:43 From Maria Pramaggiore to Everyone:
Sean—We know everything is a choice in AV criticism. If there’s music merely ‘marking time’ then in that place, maybe the image does take precedence and that’s your way of doing that?
17:22:24 From Sean O'Sullivan to Everyone:
Tricky. One of the things I like about vidcrit is that the issue of “precedence” seems always up for grabs. Video essays often forces us to reorient—however temporarily—what we think matters in an existing cinematic object. The relationship between image and sound is maybe the most immediate potential area of reorientation.
17:23:43 From Maria Pramaggiore to Everyone:
I wonder if it’s a formal issue also, Cormac—there are more ‘dead’ moments in film and tv—perhaps defined visually (going back to Sean’s comment above) than in videos, which are always working, because, as Sean said, the music is the originary cause for them.
17:24:19 From Mathias Bonde Korsgaard to Everyone:
Good point, Maria. Part of the reason why there is almost no dead space in my essay is that I wanted to emphasise the intensity of the medium of music video
17:24:42 From Maria Pramaggiore to Everyone:
What Jaap’s saying here as well.
17:26:00 From Amy Skjerseth to Everyone:
How much space to leave between audio clips and my narration is a big question for me in producing podcast episodes / audio essays, especially after playing music that’s really densely layered and is the focus of the episode/essay. Sometimes it works to fade out and play underneath, but if it’s something that really grabs your attention and has multiple elements, it needs to kind of sink in for awhile in silence before you add your narration. And it’s also a question of how much time you want to give your listeners to form their own analysis of the music before you speak about yours, a sort of ethics of leaving space for the audience to come to their own conclusions too. But music videos have their own audiovisual temporal logics, often with quick cuts, so in an audiovisual essay about music videos it makes a great deal of sense to mimic those temporal logics, especially with many examples!
17:28:50 From Sean O'Sullivan to Everyone:
Or Robert Altman, in a different way.
17:29:50 From Maria Pramaggiore to Everyone:
Really interesting question Amy, and relates to voice over and authorial voice as well. Seems like the music can’t help but be evidence, illustration of what you’re saying but it’s also…music.
17:33:29 From Sean O'Sullivan to Everyone:
Following on Adrian (again): the multiscreen, or multifilm, juxtaposition is particularly interesting in this regard—since, in my experience, the sounds is “continuous” even if the images are multiple. I’m thinking of the second of the two responses that Ariel showed to Catherine Grant’s water video. The second response juxtaposes The Piano and The Shape of Water, but the music is from The Piano throughout. So the first movie remains the framework for the second, sonically. (Not a criticism of the student’s response! Just a reflection.)
17:33:58 From Adrian Martin to Everyone:
A key essay/talk by Philip Brophy on ‘Wagnerianism’ vs aesthetic of simultaneity is in this PDF: www.academia.edu/35016527/Sound_Scripts_journal_vol_2_2009
17:34:38 From Alissa Lienhard (she/her) to Everyone:
As a student myself, those kinds of exercises would have been really helpful. Feeling called out by this; I also prefer a clean sound...
17:34:59 From Amy Skjerseth to Everyone:
Yes exactly, Maria, I always wonder what to do with voiceover in these instances—there can be an aural hierarchy between these different sonic elements but it can be fluid. I liked Mathias’s use of intertitles, giving guiding ideas and themes but also allowing the viewer to come to their own conclusions from the different clips
17:35:04 From John Gibbs to Everyone:
Walter Murch argues that we can only process 2 and half sounds at once (or something like that - I may have got the numbers wrong)
17:35:11 From Jaap Kooijman (he/him) to Everyone:
Thanks for that Alissa!
17:36:08 From Cormac Donnelly to Everyone:
That's Murch point is fascinating. He and Burtt talk about how many sets of footsteps you need to Foley for a crowd and the answer is invariably 3, any more than that is beyond comprehension
17:37:17 From Maria Pramaggiore to Everyone:
@Amy Intertitles are not so helpful for podcasts! I often find myself a little frustrated by sound effects (not music and what you are describing) in podcasts because they feel cheesy and on the nose.
17:37:44 From Amy Skjerseth to Everyone:
So interesting John and Cormac, this sort of perceptual filling-in that audiences do, where there’s just enough sonic content to spark the imagination but not to overcrowd it
17:38:07 From Ariel Avissar to Everyone:
Jason Mittell's recent videographic mini-series, "Skyler's Story" is a very interesting experiment in using split screen and layered sound: vimeo.com/667482909
17:39:03 From Cormac Donnelly to Everyone:
Agreed Ariel, the panning in part one is really interesting in terms of how we can process/follow the content
17:39:47 From Steven Sehman to Everyone:
There’s visual isolation that occurs with multiple images- we temporally approach each image; That temporal isolation doesn’t happen the same way with sound.
17:41:10 From Ariel Avissar to Everyone:
Payne's Constraints: vimeo.com/showcase/9277518
17:43:28 From Amy Skjerseth to Everyone:
@Maria exactly, it’s a challenge! On the Phantom Power podcast, we try to give a lot of time to listen to the sound or music we’re analyzing, and then some silence before the narration. But we also do some layering between music and sound effects or narration sometimes. I often turn to freesound.org for more subtle field recordings (totally know what you mean about the cheesy sound effects in some podcasts!)
17:45:05 From Jaap Kooijman (he/him) to Everyone:
https://vimeo.com/manage/videos/395216478
17:45:13 From John Gibbs to Everyone:
Thanks for all these great comments in the chat - talking about too many channels, some people are clearly much better at thinking, typing and listening at the same time than I am!
17:45:23 From Jaap Kooijman (he/him) to Everyone:
This is the one I just talked about.
17:45:31 From Alissa Lienhard (she/her) to Everyone:
@Steven That's an interesting point. Too much sound can become overwhelming and I personally always try to single out different parts, especially if there are bits of dialogue/lyrics.
17:45:31 From Ian Garwood (he/him) to Everyone:
Glad it's not just me John!
17:49:01 From Cormac Donnelly to Everyone:
Great point Sean!
17:49:14 From Adrian Martin to Everyone:
Incredibly, we collectively haven’t yet mentioned the ‘copyright police’ stamping out very any music-related video essays !!! And any ways around the law of this …
17:52:33 From Adrian Martin to Everyone:
Great point, Ian.
17:53:23 From Sean O'Sullivan to Everyone:
Thanks, Mathias!
17:53:33 From Maria Pramaggiore to Everyone:
Great workshop! Thanks Mathias and Jaap. I am interested in working together further on something!
17:54:24 From Amy Skjerseth to Everyone:
This was an amazing workshop, thank you so much, Mathias and Jaap! Yes, I would also be interested in further collaborations!
17:54:25 From Ariel Avissar to Everyone:
If everyone here's on the Discord videographic roundtable we can share more sound-related resources and links there.
17:54:36 From Ian Garwood (he/him) to Everyone:
Me too - I'll say a bit more about this in the roundtable
17:54:41 From Maria Pramaggiore to Everyone:
Thanks Ariel!
17:54:47 From Amy Skjerseth to Everyone:
Also very keen on exploring music videos in video essays
17:54:53 From Sean O'Sullivan to Everyone:
Thanks for the panel!
17:55:03 From Ian Garwood (he/him) to Everyone:
Thanks very much Mathias and Jaap
17:55:09 From Maria Pramaggiore to Everyone:
Maybe an issue on music videos...
17:55:14 From Adrian Martin to Everyone:
Thanks everyone, great session!
